Selanne is the ultimate ageless wonder.. He is simply amazing..

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Zorro says "vote for Dobber"
Angus is my best friend at dobberhockey..
Bruins believer since BIRTH..
Fav player: Cam Neely..

From Kevin Lowe, who might be a little biased:

"Selanne is getting recognized now for his longevity. But Kurri was in his own league. How many players in the NHL were the best offensively and defensively?”

Regular season

GP G A PTS PPG
Kurri - 1251-601-797-1398 1.12
Selanne - 1352-667-753-1420 1.05 (including last night's 4 pt effort)

Playoffs

GP G A PTS PPG
Kurri - 200-106-127-233 1.17 (5 Stanley Cups)
Selanne -111-41-38-79 0.71 (1 Stanley Cup)

Very interesting argument. Kevin Lowe is biased for sure and I watched a good number of Oiler games in Kurri's heyday. Damn, he was very good both sides of the ice.

In his first year without Gretzky, Kurri led the Oilers in scoring with 44 goals and 102 points. The year before, his last with the Great One, Kurri scored 43 goals and 96 points. All Gretzky? No way.
It's like saying Brett Hull was only good because of Adam Oates. False. They were just damn good together.

I would put Kurri ahead of Selanne, but I'm biased as well, being an Oiler fan. That and I have watched way more Kurri games than Selanne. In the games I have watched, I see Kurri's defensive prowess as the kicker. Fantasy hockey, sure, Selanne is better, but in the real world, Kurri was like having a Jonathan Toews; responsible and lethal.

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12 Team "Experts" Roto representing Dobberhockey 2nd
G,A,PPP,+/-,SOG,Hits,Blocks,Wins,GAA,SV% - Keep 4
4C-Kopitar,M.Koivu,Stepan,Matthias,Prospal
4L-Marleau,Steen,M.Foligno,N.Foligno,Morrow,Umberger
4R-Hossa,Hornqvist,Little,Alfredsson,Oshie
6D-Byfuglien,Phaneuf,Doughty,J.Johnson,Burns,Wideman, Kostka,Methot
2G-M.Smith,Backstrom,Reimer

12 Team Salary Cap Roto Dynasty 3rd (G,A,Pts,FPts,DPts,Pim,SOG,H,BS,W+OTL+SO,GAA,SV%)
12F-Ovechkin,Kopitar,P&E Kane,Kessel,Ryan,M&N Foligno,Ennis,Hodgson,Killorn,Horton,Wolski,Morrow ,Bonino
6D-Subban,J.Johnson,Carle,Wizniewski,Franson,Spurgeon ,Kostka,M.Fraser
2G-Rask,Anderson,Emery
Farm-Markstrom,Scrivens,Brunner,Nyquist,G.Bourque,B.Con nolly,T.Barrie,Brennan,Barberio,Orlov

Kevin Lowe is a d bag. At least in my generation, Selanne will be remembered as one of the all time greats.

Let's not forget that Kurri played in the high scoring 80s on a high flying edmonton oilers team on a line with the last player in the NHL to wear 99.

I'm not taking credit away from Kurri, but if you put selanne in his shoes, he would have performed even better than Kurri.

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16 team H2H (We keep everyone)
Positions - 2C, 2LW, 2RW, 4D, 2G, 1Util, 11 Bench, No Farm (We just keep prospects on the bench)

Scoring Cats
G ,A, +/-, PIM, PPP, SOG, Hits
Wins, Saves, SV%, GAA, SO

Year 1 = 2/16
Year 2 = 13/16
Last year = 4/16

C-Crosby, Lecavalier, Ott (LW), Schwartz, Matthias, Toffoli, Leino (LW)
L-Michalek (RW), Pacrioretty, Hagelin
R- Gallagher, Neil, Read,
D- Markov, Rielly, Wisniewski, Hamilton, Fraser, Dumba, Beauchemin, Trouba, Barrie
G-Fleury, Bryzgalov, Ward, S.Mason, Enroth,

Over the course of Kurri's career the leage produced an average of 6.09 goals per game. In Selanne's career (through last season) that number was 4.86 goals per game.

The upshot of this is that Kurri had about 25% more opportunities to score in his career (probably more since he played for one of the highest scoring teams at the time).

Selanne (end of 2012) 1341-663-743-1406-1.048

Add 25% and you get 1.31 points per game...

Obviously this isn't definitive as you don't know that Selanne would have availed himself of the opportunities, but I gotta think having 25% more chances to get on the score board is likely make an impact on one's career totals.

Oh, and yippee for the dead puck era...

(goal/game stats taken from: http://www.quanthockey.com/TS/TS_GoalsPerGame.php )

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Okay, so maybe nobody likes a cynic, but everybody f**king hates those perky optimists!

... and anyway, I make a damn good cynic.

Would selanne have kept himself in good enough shape though? Back then, guys came to training camp to get in shape. They didn't work out in the summers, and they probably smoked and drank more than guys now. If selanne did that, would he have been as good? Hard to say. That's the problem with comparing eras. For every argument for, there's one against.

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12-team Keeper pool, straight points for forwards & dmen. Goalies get: 2 points per win, 3 per shutout, 1 point per assist & 1 point per shootout loss.

Top 8 forwards, 5 dmen and 2 goalies count.

We keep 8 forwards, 5 dmen, 2 goalies & 1 rookie.

Forwards: Malkin, Stamkos, Getzlaf, Hall, Kunitz, St. Louis, Pavelski, Kadri, Purcell, Hartnell, Brunner, Weiss, Bouchard, McDonald
Defence: Letang, Enstrom, Schultz, Markov, Keith
Goalies: Price, Niemi, Brodeur

My personal blog: http://theryancokeexperience.wordpress.com

Great reply Loch! I don't disagree from a points perspective, but a big part of what made Kurri better in my opinion was his defensive play. At the end of the day, I am a big Selanne fan, but an even bigger Kurri fan. Like I said earlier, I am a little biased as I am an Oiler fan and watched tons, literally tons of games where Kurri played. To say Kurri was solely a by-product of Gretzky (and I'm not saying anyone is) is to downplay Kurri's talent.

All that said, I completely agree with the op (still trying to get used to these abbreviations!)...Teemu freakin' Selanne!!

Selanne is the first player ever in NHL to have TWO 4 point games at the age of 42 or older. Not even Gordie Howe could do it more than one time.

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UHL Pittsburgh Penguins

24 Team Fantrax Salary Cap H2H Dynasty League Daily
G, A, +/-, PIM, PPP, SHP, GWG, SOG, Hits, Blks, FOW
W, GAA, SV, SV%, SO
23 Man Roster - 3C, 3LW, 3RW, 3F, 6D, 1G, 4BN, 4IR
27 Man Minor Team

C- Tavares, Stepan, Hodgson, Shaw, Bjugstad
LW- Ryan, Perron, Downie, Killorn, Paajarvi
RW- Wheeler, Simmonds, Coyle, Frattin, Rinaldo
D- Schultz, JJ, Bogosian, EJ, Josi, Cowen, Muzzin
G- Lehtonen

F: Granlund, Silfverberg, Jensen, Dalpe, Bowman, Knight, Fasth, JAM
D: Beaulieu, Koekkoek, Gelinas, Pysyk, McCabe, Irwin
G: Nilsson, Nilstorp, Ramo, Berra, Brossoit, Gibson

Yeah, just wanted to be clear that I wasn't trying to downplay anyone's talent.

Scoring was higher for many reasons but the fact remains, it was higher.

If you compare the player's point per game rate over their career vs the league goals per game rate it turns out that, on average, Selanne would have been in on about 21% of the expected goals in games he participated in and Kurri woud have been in on 18%...

These guys are elite and both great in their own way but Kurri got a boost from playing in a more offensively charged period.

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Okay, so maybe nobody likes a cynic, but everybody f**king hates those perky optimists!

... and anyway, I make a damn good cynic.

wow, that IS impressive!

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Thats me on the street with a violin under my chin, playing with a grin, singing gibberish.





P=1 DPts=1.2 +/-=.32 PIM=.08 PPP=.4 SHP=.6 S=.015 Blk=.2 Hit=.08
W=2 OTL=.8 GA=-.64 SV=.08 SO=3

Pro (23 keep 17)
C- Filppula,Turris,Stastny,Backstrom
D-Boyle,MDZ,Karlsson,Robidas,Goligoski,Schenn,Seiden berg
G-Anderson,Hiller,Rinne
LW-Malone,Parise,Rolston,Eriksson,Ruutu
RW-Alfredsson,Callahan,Setoguchi,Brown,Ryder,Vrbata

Farm (9 keep all, max 200 GP, 100 Goalies)
Colborne,Leblanc,Loktionov,Perreault,Tangradi,Blum ,Poulin,Markstrom

I'll take Selanne all day every day over Kurri. Kurri was a fine player, to be sure, but his offensive totals are inflated due to the period in which he played. I like to use hockey-reference.com when comparing players from different eras. Their adjusted points system is great for creating an even playing field and it really makes Kurri's best seasons look less great, where Teemu's first three full seasons in Anaheim become even better. Top two in the league in goals for three seasons in a row, and let's face it, Kurri, like a lot of other players benefited greatly from playing on Gretzky's wing. Put Selanne on Gretzky's wing and HE may be the one with the goal scoring record, not Gretzky.

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1 yr H2H, 10 teams
G(3),A(2),+/-(1),PIM(0.2),GWG(1),W(5),SO(3)

3C-Stamkos/Kane (RW)/Shaw
3LW-Ovechkin/Lucic/Pacioretty/Ryan (RW)/Hagelin
3RW-Sharp (C)/St. Louis/Stewart/Brunner/Neil/Gallagher
4D-Pietrangelo/Goligoski/Ekman-Larsson/Leddy/Phaneuf/Beauchemin/Corvo
1G-Rinne/Ward/Anderson/Bishop
+1 Util