G, A, PIM, +/-, PPP, SHP, GWG, SOG
W, GAA, SV%, SA
Keep 6F 3D 1G

this post isn't meant to determine if Neal is on par with Giroux, because I think Claude reigns. in short Giroux's situation makes others play better, whereas Neal's success can be more attributed to being with more elite players in Pittsburgh, being one of those players that is better from those around him.

What I'm looking for comments and feedback on is how far behind Giroux is a 40G scorer who could likely repeat that for years to come in Pit? I think Neal is an underrated and soon to be a fantasy lock on whoever's roster he's on (might have happened already?). He may become one of those untouchables and I wonder if the time to acquire him is past?

What is the gap between an elite elite playmaker in Claude Giroux who is legitimately on one the hottest uptrends in the league, vs a 40+G, monster SOG, +/- man who will fill the net, have good peripherals, etc etc.

Thanks...

Based on last year's stats, I'm sure that format favours Neal, but I think the skill gap between these guys is large enough that I'd still take Giroux over Neal in a long-term keeper.

Neal is pretty sick, but I don't think he's underrated at all... the opposite actually. I also have my doubts about whether he will "likely repeat that for years to come".

I'm confident that Giroux on the other hand, will be an 85+ point guy for years to come.

I don't think the gap is huge by any means. But I think you've hit the nail on the head with identifying Giroux as the better option. I would see the difference being not much more than a depth player. An exception would be in a limited keeper league where it would make sense to difference would be bigger if one was trying to improve their keepers.

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Ultimate Dynasty League
16 Team Dynasty League H2H: G, A, P, PPP, SHP, +/-, PIM, SOG, W, L, GAA, SvPct, SHO

C: Stamkos, Getzlaf, Carter
LW: Ovechkin, Kovalchuk, Brown
RW: Iginla, Pavelski, Horton
D: Byfuglien, J.Johnson, Goligoski, Hedman, Hamonic
U: Mueller
G: Schneider, Hiller,
B: E. Johnson, S.Kostitsyn, Neil, Biron, Giguere
IR:
Prospect: Nail Yakupov, Tangradi

__________________________________________________ ___________________________
UHL Dynasty St. Louis Blues
...a bad team trying to rebuild...

It's close, especially in this format, but you always go with the guy who does it without help. Can't always count on stud linemates to be there

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DobberHockey Rules
14 Team Keeper, points only, best 12 skaters 2 dman 2 G count. Playoffs count.
F - Crosby, C.Smith, Wheeler, Parenteau, Hudler, Clowe, Grabovski, Atkinson, Frolik, S. Kostitsyn, Marchand, Peverley, Tavares, Read, Brouwer, Bickell, Gionta, Setoguchi
G - Anderson, Hiller, Markstrom, Brodeur
D - Letang, Del Zotto, I. White, Kronwall, Brodin, Nikitin

Neal has better all around production but Giroux has the upside...which is substantially better than Neal's IMO. I also don't believe Neal will do as well as he did last season. It would be very hard for him to do.

Also Neal loses the typical winger advantage since there are no forward designations.

I don't really understand the OP.

I think we'd all agree that Giroux creates his own offense... and that's better to rely upon.

However, I don't think Giroux may ever (yes, I said it) repeat his 93pt season (which included a tough-to-repeat 38 PPP).

I don't think that Neal will repeat his season either... but I DO think it is more likely that Neal breaks 81pts than it is for Giroux to break 93pts.


As a comparison, James Neal is a better version of Kevin Stevens.
Nobody would think that Kevin Stevens was going to improve on the 86pts he put up in 80 games in 1990-1991 playing with Lemieux & Jagr.

Oh... but he did.
1991-1992: 126pts!!!
1992-1993: 111pts!!!

See... that sort of thing CAN happen when you play with the best players in the league.

While I love Giroux... he's very similar to a player like Pavel Datsyuk. Incredibly crafty, great vision... but what if Giroux is removed from another top playmaker? He did have Jagr last year.
Datsyuk had his best year's playing on a line WITH Zetterberg.
For Giroux, I really thought he put up an extra 10pts through incredible passing with Jagr.

It's a long ramble... I'd still take Giroux over Neal... but I do think the margin between them is VERY, VERY, VERY close.

In fact, by last year's stats (standard 6-cat), Neal was better.
See attached.

Giroux is definitely the "name" pick and in points only I don't think you could really even make a comparison between the two, but with the OP's particular cats I feel quite confident saying that Neal will prove to be the better option. Giroux is a stud no doubt, but Neal is a roto monster.

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Dynasty - $100/yr buy-in - YR5 - $90M CAP
G A PTS +/- PIM PPP SOG W GAA SV% SO

C - Crosby, Giroux, Getzlaf
LW - Neal, Elias
RW - Perry, Voracek
D - Letang, Chara, Boyle, Del Zotto, Faulk
Util - Eberle, Seguin,Hossa, Pavelski
G - Rask, Lehtonen

BENCH
Selanne, Iginla, Doan, M. Foligno, Bogosian, Garrison, McDonagh, Gardiner, Bryzgalov

PROSPECT
Forsberg, Bjugstad, Eller, M. Backlund, Vatanen, R. Murphy, Lack.

2010-11 - 1st
2011-12 - 1st
2012-13 - 2nd

Personally, I think Giroux has 90-110 point talent. Neal could be a steady shot of 40/40/80 though with the occasional 85-88 point year. Not a HUGE margin, considering Neal is a lock to lineup next to 71 or 87. Another thing to consider is Giroux being named the next Flyers captain. If he is, and I fully expect him to be, there is a chance he'll put his all-around performance ahead of his personal stats (a la Datsyuk/Toews). Neal will always be a big winger with nice mitts benefiting from an elite linemate. I'd take Giroux but in this particular format it is very close IMO.

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6-GM, Wk-H2H, Keep 40
START = 13F, 6D, 2G
F Pts = G (2), A (1), PP/SH (+1), GW (+2)
D Pts = G (3), A (2), PP/SH (+1), GW (+2)
G Pts = W (3), OTL (1), SO (+2), SV (.10)

F: Backstrom, Kopitar, Perry, P.Kane, Spezza, E.Staal, Nash, Vanek, Couture, B.Ryan, Eberle, J.Staal, D.Brown, Lucic, N.Horton, Backes, Tarasenko, van Riemsdyk, T.Ennis, B.Gallagher, Armia, Teravainen
D: Karlsson, P.Subban, Pietrangelo, Shattenkirk, Doughty, Yandle, Chara, Kronwall, J.Johnson, Myers, J.Faulk, E.Johnson, A.Larsson, J.Morrow, S.Elliott, M.Rielly, Ceci
G: Price, Rask, M.Smith, Hiller